For this interview, I start a new project as I look back at past
Real Madrid seasons and ask the opinions of knowledgeable Real Madrid
observers.
This will be a semi-regular and continuous series.
The Interviewees are:
1-Spanish Author and Historian Mr. Sergio Vilariño Ferreiro @SVilarino
Mr. Vilariño is the author of ‘MÉXICO 70. 50
AÑOS DE FÚTBOL EN COLOR’
2- Spanish Author and Amateur Real Madrid Historian Mr. Sergio Galán @HemerotecaRMCF
Mr. Galán is the author of ‘Real Madrid-365
Historias
He also contributes to @soymadridista and @cihefe.
Mr. Vilariño’s contact info:
On Twitter: @SVilarino
Book Link; https://www.libreriadeportiva.com/libro/mexico-70-50-anos-de-futbol-en-color_73780
Mr. Galán’s contact info:
On Twitter: @HemerotecaRMCF
Blog: https://de-odonnell-a-chamartin.blogspot.com/
Book Link; https://www.amazon.com/Real-Madrid-365-historias-Spanish/dp/9878370003
Soccernostalgia
Question: Let’s start off by describing the state of the affairs. At the
start of the 1984/85 season, Real Madrid had not won the title since 1980 as
Real Sociedad and Athletic Bilbao had won the previous four titles. This was a
long barren period by the standards of Real Madrid. What were the realistic
expectations of the fans and the press going into the season?
@SVilarino Response: The expectations at the club are always
the same: to win. Especially in the league. It was a very long period without a
title (the longest since the arrival of Alfredo di Stefano in 1953), so there
was anxiety in the club. The economic situation was not good either, so there
was a lot of pressure on the shoulders of president Luis de Carlos. Elections
were supposed to come at the end of the season, and during the whole year there
was friction on the board of directors. Ramón Mendoza was placing himself as de
Carlos successor.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: There were really serious doubts. The
club's economy was bad and after a bad year, only Jorge Valdano was the big
face in the summer presentation. The rest of the reinforcements came from the
quarry, Michel and Ochotorena. Luis De Carlos, Madrid's president, also pulled
from the quarry for the bench and promoted Amancio to the first team. Good
football and the illusion of Castilla, who the previous year had won the 2nd
division League, were expected to have their equivalent in Real Madrid. It was
a risky gamble, but there wasn't much else to choose from either.
Photo
From: Special thanks to Josele
Carbonell
|
(Real Madrid squad) |
Soccernostalgia Question: Let’s look
at the transfer activity in the off-season. Argentine forward Jorge Valdano
arrived from Real Zaragoza as the main recruit. Dutchman Johnny Metgod left to
join Nottingham Forest, Vicente Del Bosque retired, while English striker
Laurie Cunningham left to join Olympique Marseille at France. How did public
and press view the transfer activity?
SVilarino Response: The fans knew about the tight
financial situation, but that never keeps them from asking for transfers. The
three main figures who left were past their best (Del Bosque and Cunningham),
or never captured the imagination of the crowd (Metgod). Valdano was a good
player, but I don’t think anybody could have imagined the great seasons he was
going to play at the club. The feeling among the fans was that of excitement
because of the new crop of players from the academy and Amancio.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: The
arrival of Valdano was exciting, and strange as it may seem also the marches of
the players. By only having 2 foreigners allowed, the Metgod-Valdano change did
not look bad. The Dutch did not have bad seasons, but he did not become the
defender who hooked the fans. Cunningham can be considered Hazard's precursor,
and like the Belgian, with injuries and little fortune, he ended up being
forgotten. As for Del Bosque, his age and his problems with Di Stefano, made
him barely play the last two years, so it was not a traumatic exit either.
 |
Photo
From: France Football, Issue 2007, September 25, 1984
|
(Carlos
Santillana) |
Soccernostalgia Question: To manage
the side, former great Amancio was promoted from Castilla to be the Manager,
How did public and press view this appointment?
SVilarino Response: The feeling among the fans was
that of excitement because of the new crop of players from the academy and
Amancio. The press urged the club to promote him and his ducklings the year
before. There was a famous article by the respected Julio César Iglesias where
he gave them their battle name (La Quinta del Buitre, referring to them as a
group and also to the fifth gear the Buitre appear to have) and urged di
Stefano to give them a chance. So there was a lot of expectation around this
group.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Castilla's
game hooked the public and even in several games more public went to see the
subsidiary than the first team. To this we add that Di Stefano raised several
members of the subsidiary who did not disappoint and to end the season they had
achieved the league title of 2nd. Luis De Carlos saw that he did not have the
money to make a revolution, and he "signed" Amancio to take the game
and the spirit of the subsidiary to the first team. Within the possibilities
that existed, it was the best and the most exciting.
Photo
From: Special thanks to Josele
Carbonell
|
(Real Madrid squad) |
Soccernostalgia Question: The season
started in the worst possible way with 0-3 home loss vs. Barcelona, did this
more or less foreshadow the fortunes of both teams?
SVilarino Response: It definitely showed a gulf in
class AND EXPERIENCE between both teams. Barcelona had an experienced squad,
full of internationals and with some world class players in it. Madrid was
rebuilding. Barcelona played a British type of football, with pressing, and
high pace. Madrid was still looking for their style, very influenced by a crop
of veterans who live by the laws of La Furia (Camacho, Santillana, Juanito...)
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Not
quite. It was a jug of cold water. Madrid came from a good preseason and was
hopeful of winning, but everything went wrong. Valdano was injured in the
warm-up, during the game San Jose was also injured and his substitute, Angel,
made an own goal before the break. Barcelona played much better. It was not a
match that could mark the future of both, but it is true that that same day it
began to be seen that something could not go well in the dressing room. Lozano
complained in the post-match about the physical and technical plot.
Soccernostalgia Question: Real Madrid
struggled in the League, despite being second behind Barcelona for much of the
season. What could the poor League season be attributed to?
SVilarino Response: The atmosphere at the club was
not ideal. As I said before, the board of directors was looking forward to the
elections. The squad had internal issues, with Amancio unable to have a strong
grip over some veterans. There were even scandals that involved the “innocent”
members of La Quinta, such as when Amancio discovered a group of women in the
room of two veterans (Juanito and Lozano) in Milan during the trip to play
Inter. Butragueño, although not involved, was also there (it was his room).
Changing the coach mid-season was also tough, but Molowny was a very
experienced one, and very used to this situation. He was the man who really
gave La Quinta their chance, and focused on the European campaign, that brought
really important moments for the team.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: It
is difficult to know. The relations between the veterans and the coach were not
good, that hurt the team but it is not a logical reason to throw the season
away so soon. The game was not good either and the arrival of winter was
disastrous, with 9 games in a row without winning. The fans disengaged and only
remained by European expectations, something common in bad seasons.
Photo
From: Special thanks to Josele
Carbonell
|
(Real Madrid squad) |
Soccernostalgia Question: Despite the
team’s troubles, this was the season where Emilio Butragueno ‘El Buitre’ was
introduced to the audience outside of Spain and became a household name? What
do you remember of his emergence that season?
SVilarino Response: He was a success from the very
beginning. His debut in Cádiz was fantastic, and he was able to blend very well
with the rest of the team, becoming important in Europe also. His game against
Anderlecht was probably one of the very best of his career. The Bernabeu needed
a new idol, and he was the perfect man for the role. He became a sort of “ideal
son-in-law” for everybody in Spain.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: He
was a different player. A child who appeared in an adult world, with a
self-confidence that scared and surprised in equal parts. He made the difficult
easy and when he stood in the area with the ball, the stadium was silenced
waiting for his start. He was a sprinkle of color in a gray world.
 |
Photo
From: Onze, Issue 113, May 1985
|
(Emilio
Butragueno) |
Soccernostalgia Question: This was
also the first season that I remember of ‘Remontadas’ from seemingly impossible
positions. Most notably I always remember the (6-1) win over Anderlecht.
Anderlecht were a strong team at the time and Real had seemed dead and buried
after the (0-3) first leg loss. Is this the reference point of the future
‘Remomtadas’ of this Generation?
SVilarino Response: Yes, this is the moment.
Everything was possible, even after the hardest defeats. The atmosphere at the
Bernabéu was crazy, Molowny fielded teams with barely any defensive players and
Real attacked and attacked. The crowd pushed the team, pressed the ref and that
created a wave that was impossible to stop. Even nowadays those who remember
those games would talk about the best nights in the history of the Bernabéu.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Yes,
definitely. For the youth who have seen Real Madrid win so many Champions in
recent years it may be strange, but in those years Europe was something
unattainable. The defeat in Paris in 81 and in Goteborg 83 were tough. Real
Madrid always looked to Europe to remember old successes, and especially in bad
league years. The defeat in Brussels was regrettable, but both the players and
the fans conspired separately to come back. It is difficult to explain because
there are hardly any precedents for similar situations. Perhaps the mystique of
the stadium and the shield could weigh on the Belgian team, which, as Valdano
would say, succumbed to a scenic fear. That and that the public that went to
the stadium in those years, let us remember that the European matches were not
paid but paid, it was different with more desire to fight and win. As difficult
as it was.
 |
Photo
From: France Football, Issue 2017,
December 4, 1984
|
(November
28, 1984, UEFA Cup, Anderlecht 3-Real Madrid 0) |
 |
Photo
From: France Football, Issue 2017,
December 4, 1984
|
(November
28, 1984, UEFA Cup, Anderlecht 3-Real Madrid 0) |
Soccernostalgia Question: Is the
earlier round elimination of Rijeka also a memorable ‘Remontada’? Certainly
defeating Inter (3-0) in the semifinals after (0-2) first leg loss, had the
feel of yet again overcoming impossible odds. What do you remember?
SVilarino Response: Rijeka became famous for a
reason: them having a deaf-mute player sent of for dissent. It was a very tough
game and I’m not sure if Madrid deserved to go through.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: It
was a comeback that is always forgotten by circumstances. It was a bad game,
with rain, the public did not fill the stadium and with arbitration decisions
that in some cases could be discussed. To all this is added that a famous
journalist of the time and with a lot of power, Jose Maria Garcia, said that
they had expelled Denica, a deaf-mute player, for protesting. Leaving aside
that a player can protest without speaking, his expulsion was not because of that
but because of wasted time. The team played badly and I ended up playing
against 8 to be able to come back in the last 10 minutes. She is never usually
mentioned for the bad game, for the expulsion of Denica and the rival's entity.
Antimadridismo always remembers this game and many Madridistas seem to be
ashamed, I don't know very well why when there is no reason for it.
 |
Photo
From: France Football, Issue
2038, April 30, 1985
|
(Michel
scoring, April 24, 1985, UEFA Cup, Real Madrid 3-Inter 0) |
Soccernostalgia Question: The
aforementioned (0-2) loss vs. Inter in April in the UEFA Cup seminfinals
spelled the end of Amancio as Manager. He was replaced by Luis Molowny. How did
public and press view this appointment so late in the season?
SVilarino Response: As I said, Molowny was the man
for the job. He was very well known for his previous stints as a caretaker. It
was an obvious and easy solution. The results proved it right. He was keen on a
technical, passionate, type of football, and Real fans like it.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Surprisingly.
It is true that it was known that the locker room-coach relationship was not
good. But no one could expect Amancio to be dismissed on the eve of a vital
match. A lot was said about the night at the hotel in Milan and De Carlos tried
to save the situation by breaking through the weakest link. The truth is that
he also had nothing to lose because he was not going to continue in the
presidency, and in that way he gave power and reason to the players. At least
he had a part that everyone liked, which was Molowny.
Soccernostalgia Question: Real Madrid
imploded in the League in the second half of the season and were bypassed by
Atletico Madrid, culminating with the 0-4 defeat against their neighbors. Had
Real just given up on the League and just concentrated on the UEFA Cup?
SVilarino Response: That was basically it. On
those days, if you could win the League and qualify for the European Cup, the
difference in between being second and being fourth was not big. There was no
“4th position trophy” like nowadays. Real Madrid won only FOUR games from
december 16th till the end of the season. Those are astonishing numbers.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Yes,
totally. The start of the second round was terrible and there was nothing left
but to look to Europe to try to save the season with something honorable.
 |
Photo
From: Onze, Issue 113, May 1985
|
(Ricardo
Gallego) |
Soccernostalgia Question: A disastrous
season was saved with the UEFA Cup victory (and later the League Cup win). This
European trophy was the first for the club since 1966. How is this win viewed
historically and at the time?
SVilarino Response: It was an important win. It
was viewed as a European victory, something that was much missed in Madrid. It
was also a good way to go onto the summer, when Ramón Mendoza became president
(his two rivals for the election, Eduardo Peña and Juanito Navarro withdrew),
and immediatly set off to reinforce the team and use the basis of the UEFA Cup
champions to create a strong squad able to win the league and go deep in the
European Cup.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Seeing
the development of the competition, it is considered as something epic. The return
to triumph in Europe, and more with those comebacks, is something that remained
in the legend of the club and the fans.
 |
Photo
From: Onze, Issue 114, June 1985
|
(May 8, 1985, UEFA Cup,
Videoton 0-Real Madrid 3) |
Soccernostalgia Question: While
Butragueno gaimed recognition outside of the borders. Michel and Sanchis also
started to establish themselves in the team. Valdano adapted well and scored
goals. Who else stood out in the team that season?
SVilarino Response: Obviously veterans such as
Camacho and Santillana were still important. Gallego became a mainstay of the
team (also with the National team). Same with Chendo. Martin Vázquez was
entering the picture too. It was Stielike’s last season, and that was a big
loss, because he was one of the leaders of the team. By that time his
relationship with Juanito was terrible. They faced each other the next season,
when Madrid played Neuchatel Xamax in the UEFA Cup. It was not pretty.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Oddly
enough, Molowny. When Mendoza became president he met a team that was evicted
and in two months he won 2 titles with the Canarian coach. The talisma of the
bench returned to do what he knew best: win.
Photo
From: Special thanks to Josele
Carbonell
|
(Real Madrid squad) |
Soccernostalgia Question: Let’s
discuss the old guard, how were the performances of Camacho, Gallego and
Santillana viewed? Juanito was no longer a certainty with the emergence of
Butragueno. Long-serving West German star Uli Stilieke would depart at the end
of the season after eight years. Juan Lozano who had arrived with a big
reputation from Anderlecht in 1983 returned at the end of the season after two
poor seasons. What are your thoughts on these players?
SVilarino Response: I already talked about most of
them on the question before. Juanito was still an idol for the Bernabéu, but
his character and performances were too irregular and sometimes dangerous for
the team. He was a perfect player for the remontadas, though. Lozano arrived as
a star, a player who could have been a huge success if he played in Spain 25
years laters. In the early-80s, his style didn’t fit well in La Liga, and he
had injuries and off the field issues. He went back to Belgium and was never
really the same.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Camacho
was the leader of the team, the one who pulled the locker room. An essential
figure in the template. So was Santillana, although with less weight. Gallego
was the hope for the midfield, someone a little strident but effective. Much
was expected of Lozano, especially for the price paid for it, but it was one of
the great disappointments. And as for Stielike, it was a very tough march for
the fans. At first it was not understood, especially because Hugo Sanchez of
the eternal rival arrived in his place. However, the goals soon made people
cheer for Hugo.
Soccernostalgia Question: Despite the
UEFA win somewhat putting a positive spin to the season, did the poor league
season spell the end for Miguel Angel (as a starter), Garcia Remon, Isidro,
Franciso Pineda, San Jose and Angel (Angel, Pineda, Stilieke and Lozano left at
the end of the season)
SVilarino Response: It was the emergence of a new
generation who put and end to their careers as important players. On top of
that, Mendoza wanted to upgrade key positions, and he did with Hugo Sánchez,
Maceda and Gordillo.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: Those
changes cannot be attributed only to the bad league season. At the goal, two
veterans were exchanged for young people like Ochotorena and Agustin, while at
the start there were people who were equally veteran or who had not given
everything expected. In general, the generational change that promoted the
entry of Ramón Mendoza into the presidency influenced.
 |
Photo
From: France Football, Issue
2044, June 11, 1985
|
(May 22, 1985, UEFA Cup, Real
Madrid 0-Videoton 1) |
Soccernostalgia Question: The poor
League form, also spelled the end of Luis de Carlos’ reign as President and I
suppose Ramon Mendoza took advantage to become President, how was his arrival
viewed at the time?
SVilarino Response: Mendoza’s arrival was viewed
as the beginning of a new era. It was a change of the guard at every level in
the club. New generation of players from the Academy, new coach, new president,
new signings and a team that was able to win in Europe. People were excited in
that summer of 85.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: In
reality, Luis De Carlos was already tired and decided to anticipate the end of
his term by one year, without running for reelection. Mendoza was in the
shadows and finally saw his opportunity, after losing the elections in 1982. He
had no rivals and was elected without going through the polls. The change was
like a breath of fresh air. The remains of the Bernabeu stage were left behind
and modernization arrived at the club together with three great signings: Hugo
Sanchez, Gordillo and Maceda.
Soccernostalgia Question: In closing,
have any of the players ever discussed the reasons for the poor season since?
SVilarino Response: I
don’t know.
@HemerotecaRMCF Response: For history, that season is successfully
remembered. He achieved two titles that had never been achieved and above one
of them at the European level. That caused the league championship to be
forgotten, and there are not many explanations of the negative. If it is true
that certain events of that season remain unclear, especially the night in
Milan, which culminated in Amancio's dismissal. Almost 4 decades later the
technician still does not give his version of that, which coincidentally was
his last experience as a coach.
 |
Photo
From: Onze, Issue 114, June 1985
|
(May 22, 1985, UEFA Cup, Real
Madrid 0-Videoton 1) |
